To SactownDog

[hortle]

And newsflash buttercup, ESPN's ratings are suffering too. FS1 on the whole has established itself as a legitimate network. I was worried much like you at the start, but I couldn't be more optimistic about our relationship with Fox going forward

Newsflash "buttercup" reading is fundamental. I never mentioned ratings on FS1. I am talking about ratings on Fox OTA (over the air), no clear affinity strategy and a image tied to a rapidly declining segment of the population.

This conference is mimicking winning conferences like the MWC, the Pac-12 and the Big 12. The MWC, way too late, is finally getting closer by accident because Thompson is an idiot (the common perception on the MWC board). The Pac-12 prioritizes everything but building a conference with rivalries and that people can relate to. Apparently the PAC can't read a map and tell that Utah borders no other Pac-12 state and is separated from Colorado by a major mountain range. Surprise surprise, Direct TV could care less if they carry the Pac-12 network. The Big 12 is working on being the next big east when the SEC takes Oklahoma or Oklahoma State and the Big takes Kansas. The Pac-12 might get Oklahoma and Texas just further reinforcing they have no clear affinity strategy with disparate unrelated states related only by their joint snobbery.

so you're now saying its about geographic rivalries? Maybe your marketing pedigree can correct me but rivalries based off geography seem to be a vestige largely based in college football, not basketball. Seriously, what rivalries in CBB are even talked about anymore? ESPN is responsible for breaking apart most of the rivalries that casual fans used to be able to recall.

So you're saying Fox did a great job with the Big Ten, but has completely bungled the Big East. Why did they offer this new raptrap league of misfits so much money?

edit: - off the top of my head

x vs cincy
Kentucky vs Louisville
Syracuse vs anyone who hates Syracuse
Duke vs UNC/anyone who hates Duke


Guarantee you that casual fans couldn't identify another CBB rivalry that influences the decisions of conference presidents and network heads.

[Sactowndog]

And newsflash buttercup, ESPN's ratings are suffering too. FS1 on the whole has established itself as a legitimate network. I was worried much like you at the start, but I couldn't be more optimistic about our relationship with Fox going forward

Newsflash "buttercup" reading is fundamental. I never mentioned ratings on FS1. I am talking about ratings on Fox OTA (over the air), no clear affinity strategy and a image tied to a rapidly declining segment of the population.

This conference is mimicking winning conferences like the MWC, the Pac-12 and the Big 12. The MWC, way too late, is finally getting closer by accident because Thompson is an idiot (the common perception on the MWC board). The Pac-12 prioritizes everything but building a conference with rivalries and that people can relate to. Apparently the PAC can't read a map and tell that Utah borders no other Pac-12 state and is separated from Colorado by a major mountain range. Surprise surprise, Direct TV could care less if they carry the Pac-12 network. The Big 12 is working on being the next big east when the SEC takes Oklahoma or Oklahoma State and the Big takes Kansas. The Pac-12 might get Oklahoma and Texas just further reinforcing they have no clear affinity strategy with disparate unrelated states related only by their joint snobbery.

so you're now saying its about geographic rivalries? Maybe your marketing pedigree can correct me but rivalries based off geography seem to be a vestige largely based in college football, not basketball. Seriously, what rivalries in CBB are even talked about anymore? ESPN is responsible for breaking apart most of the rivalries that casual fans used to be able to recall.

So you're saying Fox did a great job with the Big Ten, but has completely bungled the Big East. Why did they offer this new raptrap league of misfits so much money?

edit: - off the top of my head

x vs cincy
Kentucky vs Louisville
Syracuse vs anyone who hates Syracuse
Duke vs UNC/anyone who hates Duke


Guarantee you that casual fans couldn't identify another CBB rivalry that influences the decisions of conference presidents and network heads.

Rivalries are most often based off geography but can be any us versus them mentality. Others I would add:
GeorgeTown Villanova
Creighton Wichita State
SDSU UNLV
Indiana Kentucky.
Michigan Michigan State
X Dayton

And then their are those where the schools just generally hate each other:
USC UCLA
Alabama Auburn

BTW rivalries has been central to my premise all along. 6 years or so ago I would tune in to watch Wichita state Creighton play in the MVC because it was interesting.

[Xavier4036]

You are just talking in circles.

I've heard everything from the Big East problem is they are Catholic and Catholic baptisms are declining (and going into spectacular detail about numbers).... to it's actually not an FS1 problem, it's when we are on FOX that is the problem...... to FOX did it right with the Big 10 re-creating Civil War animosity and rivalry with the SEC...... and FOX did it right Big 10 because the states physically touch each other allowing for an "us vs them" rivalry (whatever the hell that means)...... to the Big East needs more hatred amongst each other and the best way to do that is to make an East and West division to create another oh-so-important "us vs them" rivalry which would surely draw national eyeballs......... to saying Wyoming and Fresno State and SDSU games are more intriguing than Big East games.

He has a self-proclaimed deep hatred for Xavier (for reasons unknown), he absolutely loathes Creighton and thinks their fans are the most smug, worst fans (for reasons he says is due to attending a volleyball game while on the Pomona Cecil Sagehens) and it appears his ONLY connection to the Big East (outside of hatred of Xavier and Creighton) is that his daughter went to Butler and his future son-in-law may some coach at Butler?

He says he is here "discuss ratings and why something needed to be done." His one solution - add his beloved Wichita State. If there is one thing we all know - adding Wichita State will not move the needle on ratings. It's not going to happen and Witchita State isn't getting an invite to the BE. Just stop posting.

[hortle]

I would like an answer to my question as to why Fox valued the reformed Big East so much when Sactowndog has it all figured out that the league is doomed to shit when contract negotiations come up again. How could Fox have made such a colossal mistake?

[DudeAnon]

Rivalries are most often based off geography but can be any us versus them mentality. Others I would add:
GeorgeTown Villanova
Creighton Wichita State
SDSU UNLV
Indiana Kentucky.
Michigan Michigan State
X Dayton

And then their are those where the schools just generally hate each other:
USC UCLA
Alabama Auburn

BTW rivalries has been central to my premise all along. 6 years or so ago I would tune in to watch Wichita state Creighton play in the MVC because it was interesting.

1. You are totally overrating the strength of some of these rivalries. I still to this day have never seen Wichita St. play Creighton and never even knew it was a rivalry. The average fan probably doesn't know about Dayton vs Xavier either.

2. Familiarity breeds contempt. I want X to beat Marquette, Villanova etc. because we are so similar. Xavier just lost to Baylor, it doesn't bother me a bit, we have nothing in common.

[jaybydna]

Creighton is Wichita's rival. Wichita is not really Creighton's. ShockerNet has a 32 page thread on how bad Creighton will be in the BigEast, and how bad the BigEast is. BlueJayUnderground doesn't even have 3.2 posts on Wichita State. I get it, your frustrated. You predicted doom for Creighton and were wrong. Predicted doom for BigEast and your are wrong. We beat you twice walking out the door, and now you are having Joan of Arc nights to get rid of all your tickets. So, you come on here to try to create a groundswell of support for inclusion, but no one, not even Creighton fans want you. And therefore, you go back to the same old argument that the BigEast is going to fail, either because of rivalries, media centers, ratings, or whatever else.

Your next statements are to point out that I am reading your message board, or that we haven't made it to the second weekend of the tournament. Save it. Heard it, and I don't want any 32 page threads here about how bad we or the BigEast are.

[Sactowndog]

You are just talking in circles.

I've heard everything from the Big East problem is they are Catholic and Catholic baptisms are declining (and going into spectacular detail about numbers).... to it's actually not an FS1 problem, it's when we are on FOX that is the problem...... to FOX did it right with the Big 10 re-creating Civil War animosity and rivalry with the SEC...... and FOX did it right Big 10 because the states physically touch each other allowing for an "us vs them" rivalry (whatever the hell that means)...... to the Big East needs more hatred amongst each other and the best way to do that is to make an East and West division to create another oh-so-important "us vs them" rivalry which would surely draw national eyeballs......... to saying Wyoming and Fresno State and SDSU games are more intriguing than Big East games.

He has a self-proclaimed deep hatred for Xavier (for reasons unknown), he absolutely loathes Creighton and thinks their fans are the most smug, worst fans (for reasons he says is due to attending a volleyball game while on the Pomona Cecil Sagehens) and it appears his ONLY connection to the Big East (outside of hatred of Xavier and Creighton) is that his daughter went to Butler and his future son-in-law may some coach at Butler?

He says he is here "discuss ratings and why something needed to be done." His one solution - add his beloved Wichita State. If there is one thing we all know - adding Wichita State will not move the needle on ratings. It's not going to happen and Witchita State isn't getting an invite to the BE. Just stop posting.

The question is about affinity Marketing of Sports teams and the Big 10 makes their own decisions about who to add not Fox.

[Sactowndog]

Rivalries are most often based off geography but can be any us versus them mentality. Others I would add:
GeorgeTown Villanova
Creighton Wichita State
SDSU UNLV
Indiana Kentucky.
Michigan Michigan State
X Dayton

And then their are those where the schools just generally hate each other:
USC UCLA
Alabama Auburn

BTW rivalries has been central to my premise all along. 6 years or so ago I would tune in to watch Wichita state Creighton play in the MVC because it was interesting.

1. You are totally overrating the strength of some of these rivalries. I still to this day have never seen Wichita St. play Creighton and never even knew it was a rivalry. The average fan probably doesn't know about Dayton vs Xavier either.

2. Familiarity breeds contempt. I want X to beat Marquette, Villanova etc. because we are so similar. Xavier just lost to Baylor, it doesn't bother me a bit, we have nothing in common.

I am not disagreeing with you. That is why teams in neighboring states or sharing a city tend to be rivals. It also helps if you have something palpable on which to base that contempt...

[JohnW22]

If Dayton was such an important rivalry to Xavier, Xavier would have still scheduled them.

[MUBoxer]

No I came on to discuss ratings and why something needed to be done. I just responded to the Creighton smack. They are free to defend their school's academic reputation which I didn't impugn until just now.

So you do not feel you're being an a$$? Interesting.