Indians vs Cubs - World Series Thread...

[billyjack]

Because of the historic significance of the Series this year, and since we have a Big East team in Chicago, a World Series thread would be cool. I only watched an inning or two last night.

Would love to hear everyone's thoughts on the Series, especially someone other than Joe Buck. I think the Cubs will win in 6 games, even after last night.

I like both teams. Since the planet revolves around Boston, I gotta point out the many Red Sox connections:
In no particular order:
- Jon Lester.
- Jon Lackey.
- Coco Crisp.
- Anthony Rizzo.
- Andrew Miller.
- Theo Epstein.
- Terry Francona.

- last time Cleveland won a World Series in 1948, they had beaten the Red Sox in a 1-game AL playoff (my father still complains that Boston started a weak pitcher, Denny Galehouse, when Mel Parnell was available)... and then they beat the Boston Braves in the Series itself.

- the 1918 Red Sox beat the Cubs in the World Series, then went 86 years til winning again.

- significant trades between the Red Sox and Cubs include: Al Nipper for Lee Smith... and wow, Dennis Eckersley for Bill Buckner... and Nomar Garciaparra to the Cubs in a 4-team trade in 2004.

Other fun facts:

- the 1908 Cubs made the World Series due to the famous "Merkle's Boner", where last week of season, on a game winning hit the Giants' runner on first (Fred Merkle) didn't tag second, was forced out, and the Cubs won in extras.

- the Cubs made 4 World Series in the 20's and 30's... 4 times, every 3 years, lost each time... 29 A's (up 8-0 in Game 4 then gave up 10 runs in 7th inning), 32 Yankees (Babe Ruth called shot Series), 35 Tigers (Detroit's first title), 38 Yankees (Dizzy Dean made comeback with Cubs after hurting arm).

- as a kid (1970's), the only games we'd get in Providence typically were local Red Sox games on Channel 38... with every one of their games at Cleveland, included in the typically light crowd was an Indian fan sitting I think in the top of the Municipal Stadium bleachers who would beat on a drum for the entire game... boom boom boom boom boom...

- the Indians broke the color barrier in the American League with Larry Doby and Satchel Paige... they also hired the first African American manager with player-manager Frank Robinson in 75.

- also as a kid (1970's), the few non Red Sox games we'd get to watch were NBC Saturday day games (mentioned in a thread at the HLoH when Joe Garagiola passed away)... very often these games would be Cubs games at Wrigley because they didn't have lights so had to play in daytime. Many years in the 70's, the Cubs would jump out to a hot start in April and May, and then cool off in the summer... Cubs fans attributed this to having to play hot exhausting day games at home all year. Lights weren't installed at Wrigley til maybe 1989... in 1984 the schedule would've put Chicago at home for start of the World Series vs Detroit if they had beaten San Diego... not sure what the solution would've been, but Games 1 and 2 might have been played on Tuesday and Wednesday afternoons... I think there hadn't been a weekday afternoon WS game since 1972 (due to a rainout) and 1970 before that.

- I think I talk too much.

[DudeAnon]

Am I the only one that thinks its cheapened a bit because of Epstein running the show? I know its cool that the Cubs are finally good but it feels like Epstein is the real legend of this.

[stever20]

Am I the only one that thinks its cheapened a bit because of Epstein running the show? I know its cool that the Cubs are finally good but it feels like Epstein is the real legend of this.

I don't think any Cubs fans would mind that 1 iota. Cubs fans would take the title any way they can get it.

Think the Cubs probably win. I'd love to see it in 5 only because that would be at Wrigley- and that would be the most incredible scene we've seen in sports in forever.

[FenwayFriar]

Billyjack- great post. And since you're correct that the world revolves around Boston, here are the other Red Sox connections to the World Series:

-Mike Napoli
-Michael Martinez (played on both the Sox and Indians this year)
-David Ross
-Cubs GM Jed Hoyer

-Out of the 50 active players on both teams, 44 of them had never appeared in the World Series prior to last night. Out of the 6 players who had World Series experience, 5 of them won a World Series with the Red Sox- Lester ('07 & '13), Crisp ('07), Lackey ('13), Napoli ('13), Ross ('13). The other player was Ben Zobrist.

-DudeAnon, not sure what you mean that it cheapens it because Theo is running the show? I think its the exact opposite; he has the chance to go down as one of the greatest baseball GM/President of Baseball Ops of all time. And also break the two most famous "curses" in all of sports. If he could win with the Red Sox and Cubs with a combined World Series drought of 194 years, it would cement him as a Hall of Fame executive at the age of only 42. Theoretically he could have another solid 30 years as a baseball executive with many many chances to win more titles (especially with this loaded Cubs team). "In Theo We Trust."

-It took me a while to pick a team to root for in this series because I love Francona, Lester, and Theo. Trying to pick between them is tough. But in the end I'm going with the Indians. Mainly because of the way Red Sox ownership started a smear campaign in the Boston Globe after he was fired in 2011. Also, I think the Cubs drought is better for baseball in that it will help ratings in the next few years since they'll still be in the mix and still trying to break the curse.

-Prediction: Indians in 6.

[Hall2012]

Since we're bringing other teams into the discussion, let's be honest...we all know the only reason the Cubs are even there is because the entire Mets pitching rotation got season ending injuries...

[stever20]

Since we're bringing other teams into the discussion, let's be honest...we all know the only reason the Cubs are even there is because the entire Mets pitching rotation got season ending injuries...

because the Mets overused their guys so much the year before. Harvey pitched 210 innings the year after TJ surgery. You just don't do that.

Cubs if they got lucky were because of the Giants quite frankly. If they had gotten a relief pitcher, they would have probably beaten the Cubs.

[FenwayFriar]

Since we're bringing other teams into the discussion, let's be honest...we all know the only reason the Cubs are even there is because the entire Mets pitching rotation got season ending injuries...

because the Mets overused their guys so much the year before. Harvey pitched 210 innings the year after TJ surgery. You just don't do that.

Cubs if they got lucky were because of the Giants quite frankly. If they had gotten a relief pitcher, they would have probably beaten the Cubs.

Agree on both. While I would have loved to see a Cubs-Mets NLCS rematch, it was clear that the Mets pitching staff wasn't going to make it thru the year. With that young staff and how many injuries there have been, some preventive measures need to be put into place for next year. And yes, if the Giants bullpen hadn't been historically bad (30+ blown saves during the regular season), MadBum might have been able to beat the Cubs single handily.

[Savannah Jay]

- also as a kid (1970's), the few non Red Sox games we'd get to watch were NBC Saturday day games (mentioned in a thread at the HLoH when Joe Garagiola passed away)... very often these games would be Cubs games at Wrigley because they didn't have lights so had to play in daytime. Many years in the 70's, the Cubs would jump out to a hot start in April and May, and then cool off in the summer... Cubs fans attributed this to having to play hot exhausting day games at home all year. Lights weren't installed at Wrigley til maybe 1989... in 1984 the schedule would've put Chicago at home for start of the World Series vs Detroit if they had beaten San Diego... not sure what the solution would've been, but Games 1 and 2 might have been played on Tuesday and Wednesday afternoons... I think there hadn't been a weekday afternoon WS game since 1972 (due to a rainout) and 1970 before that.

-First night game at Wrigley was 8/8/88
-Cubs should have had home field advantage against the Padres in '84 but, in a decision that still baffles me today, MLB literally "gave" it to San Diego because of the lights issue. So first two games in Chicago, which Cubs won. Last three at the Murph. And Leon Durham pulled a "Buckner" two years before Buckner.

[stever20]

well heard that the wind is supposed to be blowing out at least for Friday's game at Wrigley.

IMO the Cubs are in a GREAT place right now. They have a big pitching advantage in games 3 and 5. If they can take game 3, all the pressure in the world is on Kluber on short rest in game 4. Game 3 to me is the key for the series. Cubs win- they're in great shape. Indians win- they get Kluber with a shot to make it 3-1.

[MUBoxer]

So confused why we're talking about the Red Sox.

Anyways I live super close to wrigley and am proudly wearing my sox hat. That said I'm actually hoping the win just to see the celebration.