Ranking all 77 tournament champions

[Bill Marsh]

Bill,

Approximately when did the NCAA clearly surpass the NIT, in your opinion?

Below is a list of the teams in the NIT championship game over the years. A lot of current BE teams in the early years.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Invitation_Tournament

IMO by 1955 the NCAA champs were clearly the holder of the national title. I don't see a single season after that in which theNIT champs can make claim to that title.

However, "final four" is another matter. The term didn't even come into use until 1975 and that's the first time it really made sense because that was the first year of the open tournament. Before that many potential final four finishers weren't even allowed in the tournament due to the rule that only conference champions were eligible.

If the media is going to insist on referring to a "final four" before that, I suggest the following definition:

1939-49 - the 2 finalists from each tournament
1950 - the top 3 teams in each tournament since the top 2 were the same in both tournaments
1951-65 - the top 3 teams in the NCAA tournament (consolation round winner included) + NIT champs

After 1965 the final four teams in the NCAA tournament were clearly the 4 best teams who had competed for the national title. (Sorry, Marquette '70.) Unfortunately even that definition leaves some great teams, who weren't allowed to compete, on the outside looking in.

[EMT]

1970......Last time a team declined an NCAA bid for the NIT.

Nevertheless, the NIT continued to be regarded highly into the 1950s,[26][27][28][29][30][31][32][33][34][35] with BYU claiming a national championship based on their 1951 NIT title.[36] As late as 1970, Coach Al McGuire of Marquette, the 8th-ranked team in the final AP poll of the season, spurned an NCAA at-large invitation because the Warriors were going to be placed in the NCAA Midwest Regional (Fort Worth, Texas) instead of closer to home in the Mideast Regional (Dayton, Ohio).[37] The team played in the NIT instead, which it won. This led the NCAA to decree in 1971 that any school to which it offered a bid must accept it or be prohibited from participating in postseason competition, reducing the pool of teams that could accept an NIT invitation.[38]

[whiteandblue77]

"final four" is another matter. The term didn't even come into use until 1975 and that's the first time it really made sense because that was the first year of the open tournament. Before that many potential final four finishers weren't even allowed in the tournament due to the rule that only conference champions were eligible.

If the media is going to insist on referring to a "final four" before that, I suggest the following definition:

1939-49 - the 2 finalists from each tournament
1950 - the top 3 teams in each tournament since the top 2 were the same in both tournaments
1951-65 - the top 3 teams in the NCAA tournament (consolation round winner included) + NIT champs

After 1965 the final four teams in the NCAA tournament were clearly the 4 best teams who had competed for in.

prophetic in my guess on the subjectivity, saying the final four should have been the final two is stupid

[Bill Marsh]

"final four" is another matter. The term didn't even come into use until 1975 and that's the first time it really made sense because that was the first year of the open tournament. Before that many potential final four finishers weren't even allowed in the tournament due to the rule that only conference champions were eligible.

If the media is going to insist on referring to a "final four" before that, I suggest the following definition:

1939-49 - the 2 finalists from each tournament
1950 - the top 3 teams in each tournament since the top 2 were the same in both tournaments
1951-65 - the top 3 teams in the NCAA tournament (consolation round winner included) + NIT champs

After 1965 the final four teams in the NCAA tournament were clearly the 4 best teams who had competed for in.

prophetic in my guess on the subjectivity, saying the final four should have been the final two is stupid

Final 2 NCAA + Final 2 NIT = Final 4

What's stupid is that last night's broadcast referred to Oklahoma's appearance in their 5th Final Four. One of those was 1939 when Oklahoma won exactly 1 game before being eliminated.

Equating Oklahoma's 1939 "final 4" with one achieved in 2016 is just plain dumb.