Villanova

[RedStormHoops]

Xavier did their part as a 6 seed last year.

I guess we have a different idea of what "getting it done" means

Getting the soft second rd game and going to the sweet 16 as a 6 seed is certainly not a better season than earning the number two overall see and falling one round prior to what Xavier did. Nova went to the sweet 16 in 2008 with the soft second rd game, I doubt you would find many nova fans who say 2008 was more of a success than 2014 or 2015.

Also "getting it done" is not just making the sweet 16.

They got it done. They beat who they were supposed to and represented very well against a better team in Arizona.

[NovaBall]

You can give me the complete history of Villanova basketball all you want. They still need to win some damn tournament games for us to get the respect we want as a conference. Blame it on Josh Hart getting into foul trouble or whatever.

But when the best big east team by far loses to a middle of the pack ACC team, it hurts. That's why come March we are all huge nova fans.

This conference needs more than just one team to make a run in March to get the respect we want. Anyone else feel free to lend a hand?

Yea but when one team rolls through the conference EVERY year it's most important that they step up in the tournament. I wish my team was as dominant in conference, but they aren't.

Do you think Kansas is an embarrassment in the years they bowed out early?

[RedStormHoops]

.

But when the best big east team by far loses to a middle of the pack ACC team, it hurts. That's why come March we are all huge nova fans.

This conference needs more than just one team to make a run in March to get the respect we want. Anyone else feel free to lend a hand?

Yea but when one team rolls through the conference EVERY year it's most important that they step up in the tournament. I wish my team was as dominant in conference, but they aren't.

Do you think Kansas is an embarrassment in the years they bowed out early?[/quote]

It doesn't matter. Kansas isn't in a conference trying to establish themselves as a force in college basketball. We are. And our best team, needs to lead the way by winning some tournament games. That's all. You can argue all you want. But nova fans love to talk about how good they are, and that's fine, but that also means I'm allowed to express my dissapointment that they aren't getting it done in March

[Westbrook#36]

So I guess this is the new take shots at Villanova thread? What happened to the multiple old ones? Where's gtmo at, he's good for a few shots. Seriously, I'm thinking I'm going to be a major a-hole if we make a deep run, might as well with all the shit a bunch of you throw at us.

[Westbrook#36]

But nova fans love to talk about how good they are, and that's fine, but that also means I'm allowed to express my dissapointment that they aren't getting it done in March

More like we have to defend ourselves from this line of crap on a daily basis, and let's not get started on disappointment there Johnny's fan. You guys are swimming in it.

[NovaBall]

Another thing:

It's not better to have 6 teams in the middle range hoping two or maybe three sneak through to the second weekend, but no one really threatening for the third weekend. You know what that is? A good season for the Atlantic ten.

You want your top teams to be considered contenders. And of course you want them to advance far, but reality is that doesn't always happen. But you want the top guys to be respected like a title contender.

And it is tough to do that. Takes four months of good play to make that happen. And that's much more valuable than being a middle seed that catches a soft second rd opponent and goes to the sweet 16 before losing to a team viewed as a real contender.

In other words, I would take those early 1980's DePaul teams over nova 2008 or Xavier last yr or any one of those old Atlantic ten 6 seeds that snuck into the second weekend.

[DudeAnon]

*sigh*

[XUFan09]

Xavier did their part as a 6 seed last year.

I guess we have a different idea of what getting it done means

Getting the soft second rd game and going to the sweet 16 as a 6 seed is certainly not a better season than earning the number two overall see and falling one round prior to what Xavier did. Nova went to the sweet 16 in 2008 with the soft second rd game, I doubt you would find many nova fans who say 2008 was more of a success than 2014 or 2015.

Although I give Xavier credit for following up a mediocre regular season last ur with two tourney wins. That is appreciated by me. At least you guys are contributing.

This ur nova and Xavier are both doing their parts. If one or even both fell early, they still did their part keeping the conference in the headlines al winter. If seton hall or butler step up and win an unexpected game or two in the dance, kudos to them too.

I'm talking about fulfilling expectations, not about overall success. In a sense, I'm talking about fulfilling the obligations of your seed. Xavier did that for a 6 seed by first doing the minimum, winning their first game, and then on top of that winning another game. They couldn't choose the opponent they faced to get there, and they still won that game against a team who had to win to get there. Making the Sweet 16 isn't an enormous accomplishment for a 6 seed, but it is the upper level of expectations. Xavier did their part for the Big East last year.

Villanova, though, fell two rounds short of minimum expectations for a 1 seed. It happens, but I wouldn't consider it that great of a year because of how sourly it finished, just as I wouldn't consider Xavier's 2011 campaign to be anything but disappointing, despite the solid regular season that netted a 6 seed, because they lost in the first round (as Marquette fans will remember). Nor would I consider their 2003 season to be anything but disappointing and only an okay season after 3-seeded Xavier lost in the second round.

There's no need to put lipstick on a pig and try to call it something else. I'm a Cardinals baseball fan, but I'm not going to act like having the best record in baseball last season was anything special when it was followed up by a first-round playoff loss. Seasons are made or broken in the playoffs, and there's only so much the regular season can contribute to that.

But in defense of Villanova, upsets happen, because it's a single-elimination tournament. Some fans getting on Villanova's case seem to be implying (when they're not outright saying it) that Villanova just chokes in the postseason, and that's a load of B.S. Programs get unlucky sometimes. Villanova has had good tournament success not too long ago. The last two years have just been underwhelming because of how they finished, but that doesn't say anything for this year. In fact, the players can learn from past failures and come into the tournament this year with a good amount of experience.

[GumbyDamnit!]

I think even Villanova fans need to root against Nova for a few games.... to save themselves of potential embarrassment. It will be ugly if Nova goes undefeated and has an early exit. Ugly for everyone involved in this conference.

I've heard this mentality voiced a few times on this board. I don't get it even a little bit. So Nova needs to win in March so the rest of the BE programs don't feel embarrassed? How about you feel embarrassed because your own team can't make the tourney or win a couple tourney games on their own. Or maybe you should be "embarrassed" that your team doesn't sufficiently challenge the top teams in the league enough to make them battle tested?

Have we embarrassed the league by being ranked in the Top 10 each of the last 3 years? Would X "embarrass" the BE this year should they lose in the R32? Of course not. They are having a great year and deserve all the positive press they are getting. So them being covered by ESPN, and SI and CBS Sports, that brings our conference exposure, means sh!t if they don't win in March? Got 'it.

March is often about matchups and luck. UCONN beats Nova and 4 others in route to a NC. Somebody explain how Nova (and everyone else they played I guess) should be "embarrassed" by losing to the eventual Nat. Champ. NC St beat Duke, UNC and L'ville (all E8 teams) last year. PC had to play Dayton on their home floor. X made the S16 based on wins against an 11 seed and a 14 seed. You play who you play but not exactly a murderers row. Does anyone really think that any of the BE teams last year would not have won both of those games were they matched against those two teams? They were on the right side of a very fortunate draw.

Many of these negative comments are spoken by fans of teams that are used to others doing the heavy lifting. I can tell you that as a Nova fan I will never feel "embarrassed" by this team. We're the BIG dogs of this new conference. Someone knock us off, before running your mouths. 21 straight conference wins. Only 3 teams have beaten us over 3 years. Sorry that we're "embarrassing" the rest of the league with our play the last 3 years.

[NovaBall]

Xavier did their part as a 6 seed last year.

I guess we have a different idea of what getting it done means

Getting the soft second rd game and going to the sweet 16 as a 6 seed is certainly not a better season than earning the number two overall see and falling one round prior to what Xavier did. Nova went to the sweet 16 in 2008 with the soft second rd game, I doubt you would find many nova fans who say 2008 was more of a success than 2014 or 2015.

Although I give Xavier credit for following up a mediocre regular season last ur with two tourney wins. That is appreciated by me. At least you guys are contributing.

This ur nova and Xavier are both doing their parts. If one or even both fell early, they still did their part keeping the conference in the headlines al winter. If seton hall or butler step up and win an unexpected game or two in the dance, kudos to them too.

I'm talking about fulfilling expectations, not about overall success. In a sense, I'm talking about fulfilling the obligations of your seed. Xavier did that for a 6 seed by first doing the minimum, winning their first game, and then on top of that winning another game. They couldn't choose the opponent they faced to get there, and they still won that game against a team who had to win to get there. Making the Sweet 16 isn't an enormous accomplishment for a 6 seed, but it is the upper level of expectations. Xavier did their part for the Big East last year.

Villanova, though, fell two rounds short of minimum expectations for a 1 seed. It happens, but I wouldn't consider it that great of a year because of how sourly it finished, just as I wouldn't consider Xavier's 2011 campaign to be anything but disappointing, despite the solid regular season that netted a 6 seed, because they lost in the first round (as Marquette fans will remember). Nor would I consider their 2003 season to be anything but disappointing and only an okay season after 3-seeded Xavier lost in the second round.

There's no need to put lipstick on a pig and try to call it something else. I'm a Cardinals baseball fan, but I'm not going to act like having the best record in baseball last season was anything special when it was followed up by a first-round playoff loss. Seasons are made or broken in the playoffs, and there's only so much the regular season can contribute to that.

But in defense of Villanova, upsets happen, because it's a single-elimination tournament. Some fans getting on Villanova's case seem to be implying (when they're not outright saying it) that Villanova just chokes in the postseason, and that's a load of B.S. Programs get unlucky sometimes. Villanova has had good tournament success not too long ago. The last two years have just been underwhelming because of how they finished, but that doesn't say anything for this year. In fact, the players can learn from past failures and come into the tournament this year with a good amount of experience.

What about the obligation of keeping the conference relevant throughout the season, giving the conference respect throughout the season, and earning better than a 6 seed?

You honestly would take a 6 seed with a sweet 16 over a 1 seed with a round of 32? I'm guessing you have never experienced the latter if so.

I have seen my team earn good seeds and do well in the dance. I have seen my teams barely make the dance and sneak out an upset or two. And I have seen my team do well all season and fall a little short in the dance.

There is no way you can convince me that 2008 Villanova was a better year than 2014 nova, 2014 Creighton, or 2015 nova. That's just ridiculous. You're talking about one more win in the dance. You're talking about a sweet 16 trips, not a final four run. That's an Atlantic ten mindset, where pulling off the early rounds upset is better than having a great team that runs the risk of getting upset.

One of these years you hopefully see Xavier have a great season and earn a top seed. And hopefully not this yr, because we all want to see them do well, but one or two of those times (if they can earn a top seed more than once) they may fall in the 8/9 or 7/10 game. And then you will realize how ridiculous your position that having a mediocre regular season but winning one extra tourney game is better than going out in red 2 as a high seed.

And there is no need to put lipstick on a pig, because nova's 2014 and 2015 seasons were not pigs, they were spin credibly fun seasons that ended a couple games early.

If Xavier runs the table this yr, wins the big east, and earns a 1 seed, and falls in a close game to Texas or notre dame in re 2, I won't be calling this year a pig. And I doibt looking back on it you will ultimately consider your magical run to the set 16 as a 6 seed to be a more fulfilling season.