Doug Gottlieb Is A f--- Boy

[XUFan09]

Yeah, I definitely don't think weak SOS when I think of Villanova. It's not like Marquette's schedule (and to a degree I understand Wojo's reasoning; he had no idea what he would have other than a couple scholarship players and some walkons).

[aughnanure]

Anyone who wants to put us under the microscope - be my guest. When the original 7 broke away we were killed by the media. We could never survive without football. The ACC would take over MSG as it would have no interest in us. We could never command a television deal that would put us more than slightly above the A-10. We would never get the type of bids to the NCAA tourny like we did in the old conference. We would never be able to attract and retain high level coaches. Players would not want to come to a glorified "CYO" league.

Into our third year the Big East is not only alive, it is well. Very well. Our RPI is higher than most of the Football 5 conferences and was last season as well. We have averaged five bids a year in the NCAA - half our membership. In two years, Nova, G'Town, Providence, SJU, Creighton, X, and Butler have all received NCAA bids. Including pre-season rankings, Quette, SJU, Nova, Providence, Creighton, G'Town, Seton Hall, X and Butler have all been ranked over the last two seasons. Our TV dollars are almost THREE TIMES MORE than the basketball schools were getting in the old Big East. Our schools have more games on national television than any other league. We have done extremely well against the Football Five and have secured a long term series with the Big Ten. Our Garden lease runs through 2026. We are in our own conference - we control our own destiny. We are recruiting top players from across the country as well as our own backyards. There is no question this league is a good thing for all of us and for college basketball. It's all good from where I sit.

I think the question becomes can you be an elite league w/o an elite team. I feel the answer to that question is yes.

I actually agree with his point here, and it's why most of us are/were a bit worried about the BE when we split. The other "elite" conferences have at least one "blue blood" type program to hang their hat on (B1G - Indiana, Michigan St; ACC - Duke, UNC; SEC - Kentucky; BigXII - Kansas; PAC12 - UCLA, Arizona). That doesn't include the programs the media will treat elitish when they're good like Syracuse, Louisville, Texas, Oklahoma, Michigan, Florida, LSU, tOSU, etc. I think that is a fair worry. Big XII can be as bad as they want, but they always know they have Kansas sitting there holding them up. Its like a safety net. Same thing with the SEC and Kentucky/Florida. Georgetown would seem to be that "name" program to take this mantle, but they've never truly been on a level comparable to a Kansas and Kentucky and have been more hanging around the top 15-30. But I guess the Old BE also didn't have a main blue-blood either ( a combo of SJU/GTown/UCONN/Cuse depending on the era). I dont know, but it is my one major worry - having a KU or UK just gives the league that security that someone in the league will be in the top 10 no matter what. I do think some combination of the league's most storied-programs (Villanova, Marquette, Georgetown, St. John's) needs to be good every year simply to help the perception of the league with the casual fans/media.

There's a reason we passionately root for the other Big East teams, and it's because we are (at least a little bit) slightly worried about the football schools stepping on our neck and threatening our relevancy. Mizzou and Kansas State fans never would root for Kansas in the non-con. Same for Maryland fans rooting for UNC and Duke. There's a reason we do. It matters more that we are all good. I can't wait for when the day comes that Depaul and St. John's are 1 and 2 in the BE and both ranked in the top 12. I mean, that is year is 2055, but I can't wait.

EDIT: I hope St. John's fans know that is a rip on DePaul and not them. I think SJU will be back and bigger very soon (along with MU!). Was just dreaming about having two stud programs in the two largest media markets.

[Westbrook#36]

Simply put, we do have different ideas of elite, and Villanova doesn't meet mine. Mine is a really tough standard to meet that even damn good teams fall short of, so yes, to call my distinctions "crapping" on potential wins against Villanova is strong hyperbole. And since I said that I think there are no elite teams this year, I don't get your question about whether I'd think Villanova was elite if they finish ahead of Xavier and win the Big East this year. Since no teams are elite to me this year, how could one team become elite simply by finishing ahead of a very good team? It's possible for a conference to be elite without having elite teams. This year's Big East is likely going to be a good example of that.

Agree to disagree, and you're dealing some hyperbole yourself.

[Westbrook#36]

I can get saying Nova is not elite, depending on your definition of elite(meaning the creme de la creme). It's honestly splitting hairs, saying Nova is really really good but not elite, but make no mistake about our last 2 season were elite even if you say the team wasn't. Those teams were legit F4 contenders, just ran into a red hot eventual NC team and a really tough match-up.

As for our ooc since the beginning of the 13-14 season Nova is 32-2 in the ooc regular season. Those 2 losses? @ #2 Syracuse and just the other day to #6(and under rated)Oklahoma. That's it, again so we're clear, 32-2 ooc since the beginning of the 13-14 season with wins against #2 Kansas, #23 Iowa, #14 VCU, #19 Michigan, Syracuse, Illinois, Georgia Tech, Stanford, and not even mentioning our Big 5 games which aren't easy even if we make them look that way most of the time. Not to mention our 32-4 record in BE, so call it what you will, I'll call it pretty damn impressive.

in college basketball though, you can't just look at the OOC record. its who you have played. And in the period you are talking about- Nova has only 4 top 50 wins based on where the team was end of year. 11 wins with teams ranked in Ken Pom 188 or worse in that period- with 3 more on the way this year.

question, why has Wright gone so soft on the schedule? Oklahoma and Virginia are great- but that's 2 games. Got 11 holes other places- and like this year, he's got 5 dogs. 2 are Big 5 opponents. but Delaware, Fairleigh Dickinson, and East Tennessee St? and then pretty poor exempt tournaments. this year Ga Tech and Stanford aren't good. next years tourney if memory serves me right is poor. and that makes the Gavitt games opponent of Nebraska so puzzling.

You are making up for that little bit of lost time in your trolling vessel. Sorry but you have a really weak argument, look at the names Nova played the last 2 years. It's not our fault some of those team under performed, we play who is in front of us, and who we scheduled to put in front of us was pretty damn strong in name recognition. Sorry if it doesn't meet your approval, who am I kidding, your disapproval is more than enough approval. You're the George Costanza of the board, the opposite of what ever your thinking is correct.

[anXUfan]

I think Villanova has had elite level regular season performance the last 2 seasons.

[stever20]

I can get saying Nova is not elite, depending on your definition of elite(meaning the creme de la creme). It's honestly splitting hairs, saying Nova is really really good but not elite, but make no mistake about our last 2 season were elite even if you say the team wasn't. Those teams were legit F4 contenders, just ran into a red hot eventual NC team and a really tough match-up.

As for our ooc since the beginning of the 13-14 season Nova is 32-2 in the ooc regular season. Those 2 losses? @ #2 Syracuse and just the other day to #6(and under rated)Oklahoma. That's it, again so we're clear, 32-2 ooc since the beginning of the 13-14 season with wins against #2 Kansas, #23 Iowa, #14 VCU, #19 Michigan, Syracuse, Illinois, Georgia Tech, Stanford, and not even mentioning our Big 5 games which aren't easy even if we make them look that way most of the time. Not to mention our 32-4 record in BE, so call it what you will, I'll call it pretty damn impressive.

in college basketball though, you can't just look at the OOC record. its who you have played. And in the period you are talking about- Nova has only 4 top 50 wins based on where the team was end of year. 11 wins with teams ranked in Ken Pom 188 or worse in that period- with 3 more on the way this year.

question, why has Wright gone so soft on the schedule? Oklahoma and Virginia are great- but that's 2 games. Got 11 holes other places- and like this year, he's got 5 dogs. 2 are Big 5 opponents. but Delaware, Fairleigh Dickinson, and East Tennessee St? and then pretty poor exempt tournaments. this year Ga Tech and Stanford aren't good. next years tourney if memory serves me right is poor. and that makes the Gavitt games opponent of Nebraska so puzzling.

You are making up for that little bit of lost time in your trolling vessel. Sorry but you have a really weak argument, look at the names Nova played the last 2 years. It's not our fault some of those team under performed, we play who is in front of us, and who we scheduled to put in front of us was pretty damn strong in name recognition. Sorry if it doesn't meet your approval, who am I kidding, your disapproval is more than enough approval. You're the George Costanza of the board, the opposite of what ever your thinking is correct.

Not this year... Yes Oklahoma and UVA are good. but the Exempt tournament was not good at all. East Tennessee St, Akron, Stanford, and Georgia Tech. Big 5, but then a lot of dreck.

And then next year- this is the exempt tournament: Boise State, College of Charleston, Mississippi State, UCF, UTEP, Villanova, Wake Forest and Western Michigan. Virginia at home. Big 5. Sorry, but that like this year is just a pretty meh schedule. Maybe if you're lucky 2 tourney teams.

[Westbrook#36]

I guess being ranked in the top 10 for the past 2 years and earning a #1 and #2 seed isn't considered elite in your book, no big deal about 98% of the teams in the country would've loved to trade places with us the last 2 years. Agree to disagree.

I can think of 16 sweet teams from last year and 16 more the previous year that wouldn't want to trade places so it's actually about 95.2% of teams would like to switch places with you for sure. Then you have to figure in other upsets, like Wichita state was a one seed but like you didn't make the sweet 16, so I doubt they'd want to trade places and Kansas was a two seed as well so I don't think they'd want to trade places.

See I'm not so sure bout that, would I give up a 32-2 regular season record, a BE & BE tourney title for 1 extra win in the tourney and 1 only. Especially if that win was against Georgia State or UAB? It's not a cut and dry decision. Even if Nova lost in the S16 last year we would still be taking some heat. But I agree in principle though, a S16 team probably wouldn't trade places, even though a couple should really think hard about. I guess my question is, how much is a dominant regular season record, a league title, and a league tourney title worth?

[NovaBall]

By that logic nova wouldn't trade its 2008 sweet 16 team for either the 2014, 2015, 1997 rd of 32 teams or even the 1996 first round loss team?

Yeah right!!

the tourney is the ultimate measuring stick, and as a nova fan we have been blessed with a bunch of tourney wins over the past decade. But let's not go pretending that winning one extra game I the tourney would turn a 21-12 season into a better year than a 30+ win season, unless that extra win is to send you into the final four.

Geez, some of you are flat out nuts.

[Westbrook#36]

By that logic nova wouldn't trade its 2008 sweet 16 team for either the 2014, 2015, 1997 rd of 32 teams or even the 1996 first round loss team?

Yeah right!!

the tourney is the ultimate measuring stick, and as a nova fan we have been blessed with a bunch of tourney wins over the past decade. But let's not go pretending that winning one extra game I the tourney would turn a 21-12 season into a better year than a 30+ win season, unless that extra win is to send you into the final four.

Geez, some of you are flat out nuts.

If it's all about the tourney, then why are so many on here losing their mind about Nova losing to #6 Oklahoma in early Dec. in Hawai'i? It's all about March, unless Nova loses to somebody, then the sky is falling.

BTW I was pulling a stever devil advocate hoping to reel someone in.

[stever20]

By that logic nova wouldn't trade its 2008 sweet 16 team for either the 2014, 2015, 1997 rd of 32 teams or even the 1996 first round loss team?

Yeah right!!

the tourney is the ultimate measuring stick, and as a nova fan we have been blessed with a bunch of tourney wins over the past decade. But let's not go pretending that winning one extra game I the tourney would turn a 21-12 season into a better year than a 30+ win season, unless that extra win is to send you into the final four.

Geez, some of you are flat out nuts.

If it's all about the tourney, then why are so many on here losing their mind about Nova losing to #6 Oklahoma in early Dec. in Hawai'i? It's all about March, unless Nova loses to somebody, then the sky is falling.

BTW I was pulling a stever devil advocate hoping to reel someone in.

It's not that they lost to Oklahoma. It's how they lost to them. It's a carbon copy of what happened to NC State. And if they play like that in March this year, they get beat yet again.