Sanogo question

[muskeagle]

I am NOT trying to start a hate filled topic, just asking a serious question of posters who watch Seton Hall more than I have (the two games against X and parts of a couple of others): Is Sanogo a dirty player?

In the first X game, he got away with throwing a pretty vicious shoulder that sent Macura flying pretty good. It looked iffy, but I know JP is an irritant, and while that doesn't make the move "ok" it can certainly be understood. In last night's game, there was another little thing I saw that seemed overly chippy (at the time--although exactly what it was I can't remember). I'm not saying he is....I really don't know, but I've seen two little things that made me lean in that direction. I'm asking...not accusing. I get tired of people jumping to conclusions based on one play against their team. Seton Hall guys: what do you think of him?

[Hall2012]

He's a physical player, that's it. Seton Hall's a physical team. While I've seen other SHU players go over the top on occasion, I can't say Sanogo's one of them. Remember that when a player "goes flying" in basketball it's almost always 20% contact/80% dive.

[muskeagle]

He's a physical player, that's it. Seton Hall's a physical team. While I've seen other SHU players go over the top on occasion, I can't say Sanogo's one of them. Remember that when a player "goes flying" in basketball it's almost always 20% contact/80% dive.

Fair enough....Xavier's a physical team too. I remember 20/80 rule....but that ain't what happened the time JP "went flying"....at least not on the Sanogo play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfxRfcKuBzI 2:02 mark of the highlights. There was a view from under the basket that was even clearer....he slowed up, eyed Macura running down and rammed his shoulder right at him.

[Hall2012]

I'm sure this'll be an unpopular opinion considering the ratio of X/Hall fans on this board, but agree to disagree is the best you'll get from me here. Looks like a little pick that JP made look a lot worse than it really was. I see worse that that at least 10x a game a the college level.

[hoyahooligan]

He's a physical player, that's it. Seton Hall's a physical team. While I've seen other SHU players go over the top on occasion, I can't say Sanogo's one of them. Remember that when a player "goes flying" in basketball it's almost always 20% contact/80% dive.

Fair enough....Xavier's a physical team too. I remember 20/80 rule....but that ain't what happened the time JP "went flying"....at least not on the Sanogo play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfxRfcKuBzI 2:02 mark of the highlights. There was a view from under the basket that was even clearer....he slowed up, eyed Macura running down and rammed his shoulder right at him.

don't know what you're talking about man he barely touched him. That was mostly momentum and driving.

[cu blujs]

From an an in objective viewer, I'd say that's more like 5% contact 95% dive. If that's your Exhibition A for making the case Sanogo is dirty, you don't have a case.

[muskeagle]

Well, obviously, I disagree....in that I think that play is worse than you guys are playing it off to be. The whole game is on video here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gbk4klFLQE) and it shows the other angles I remembered seeing at the 1:04:30 (or so mark). A dirty play to me, is a play that is not a basketball move that is designed to do harm in some way. The other angles clearly show that Sanogo slowed, looked, saw Macura and in a play that was not designed to do anything other than take a cheap shot at Macura, he took it. I think there is no doubt, it was a dirty play (in the SAME way that you might argue that play Bluiett made shortly after--holding Sanogo's arm--which both temporarily hurt Sanogo--leading to the time to show the replays--and got an over the back call on Sanogo--could be called a dirty play). While Macura is sometimes guilty of flopping, I don't think that is a flop--not even close. He was in an all out sprint and was hit unexpectedly in midstride. I agree there are harder hits in games, but the only purpose here seemed to be the chance to get in a cheap shot...there was no other advantage to it.

That said, one cheap shot or dirty play, doesn't make one a dirty player....and that was what I was trying to ask about. I think it's pretty clear Sanogo was hunting for Macura on that play and was wondering if that is his MO or just a thing where maybe he was frustrated with the irritation that JP can be. Clearly, I'm not going to get that answer, but that's all I was asking.

[BEXU]

Not really seeing it either. It's a physical league.

[Hall2012]

Well, obviously, I disagree....in that I think that play is worse than you guys are playing it off to be. The whole game is on video here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gbk4klFLQE) and it shows the other angles I remembered seeing at the 1:04:30 (or so mark). A dirty play to me, is a play that is not a basketball move that is designed to do harm in some way. The other angles clearly show that Sanogo slowed, looked, saw Macura and in a play that was not designed to do anything other than take a cheap shot at Macura, he took it. I think there is no doubt, it was a dirty play (in the SAME way that you might argue that play Bluiett made shortly after--holding Sanogo's arm--which both temporarily hurt Sanogo--leading to the time to show the replays--and got an over the back call on Sanogo--could be called a dirty play). While Macura is sometimes guilty of flopping, I don't think that is a flop--not even close. He was in an all out sprint and was hit unexpectedly in midstride. I agree there are harder hits in games, but the only purpose here seemed to be the chance to get in a cheap shot...there was no other advantage to it.

That said, one cheap shot or dirty play, doesn't make one a dirty player....and that was what I was trying to ask about. I think it's pretty clear Sanogo was hunting for Macura on that play and was wondering if that is his MO or just a thing where maybe he was frustrated with the irritation that JP can be. Clearly, I'm not going to get that answer, but that's all I was asking.

The advantage to be gained is that Macura was racing back looking to block Desi's shot from behind. Would he have gotten there in time? I don't think so, but he'd have gotten close. Sanogo's little pick just made sure he didn't. It could've been called an illegal screen, but I don't see anything more than that in it. I also still think Macura made a meal of it.