2017 Recruiting Class Could Be The Best Yet

[milksteak]

We are still the favorites to land Wabissa Bede and Christian David, both Top 100 guys on 247. We are just one of the ten teams in the conference. Stever is gonna have a conniption by the end of this recruiting season.

[ChelseaFriar]

We are still the favorites to land Wabissa Bede and Christian David, both Top 100 guys on 247. We are just one of the ten teams in the conference. Stever is gonna have a conniption by the end of this recruiting season.

I hope you guys land Bede. I think he's going to be a great 4 year player. I wish Cooley went after him harder but he seemed to really focus on Makai Ashton-Langford, who is down to UConn and PC but appears to be a heavy UConn lean at this point.

[stever20]

my point is that recruiting hasn't really taken much of an uptick with the new conference. Go look at the 2011 and 2012 classes. They were excellent. 2012 had 13 4 and 5 star guys. 5 top 30 schools. 11 had 7 top 50 schools.

And my point is that a lot of what is left in the top 100 is in the top 50 and that's not normally where the Big East makes a lot of push. That's just the reality of things.

Lets see if the Big East can keep 6 teams in the top 50. Got 7 in the top 50 right now- but Providence, Seton Hall, and even St John's need to get more players to remain in the top 50.

Stever being Stever. Classic. Warns us all that, "just wait recruiting is going to fall off big time in this new conference." Then when it doesn't claims victory and states that "it might be similar to how it was before, no better." Yet he fails to recognize that programs like Creighton, Seton Hall, Butler and X, are now recruiting at a significantly higher level than before.

Your statement above that recruiting now is the same as Big East 2011-2012 is as much an admission of being wrong than anything you can write. Keep on moving that agenda forward.

#NationalF'ingChamps

So I went to the 247 composite team rankings for the last 6 years.... Here's the current Big East teams average ratings for those 6 years...
2009 109.3
2010 65.6
2011 47.1
2012 54.0(note only 9 schools had recruits Seton Hall didn't- I gave them just a 150)
2013 66.9
2014 50.6
2015 60.4
2016 52.2

Of the 10 schools, 3 are recruiting weaker now than before- Georgetown(37.75 before to 56.25 now), Nova(23.5 to 38), and Marquette (32.25 to 34). I think part of my prism with recruiting is Georgetown. In 2009-12- Georgetown was 106,12,16,17. 37.75 average- but 3 top 20 years. 2013-16 Georgetown was 89,7,26,103. 56.25 average- with only 1 top 20 year.

4 are stronger but slightly(within 10 spots).. St John's, Xavier, PC, and DePaul. Of those 4.. St John's had a 146 class in '10. Xavier had a 170 class in '09. DePaul had a 137 class in '09. Xavier in particular very misleading with the average. They had the following classes in the 4 years- 170, 19, 21, 26.

3 are much stronger. Butler(misleading because '09 had a 213 class- other 3 years were 63,61,57- so avg of 60.3 compares favorably to 65.25 in last 4 years).
Seton Hall(this one I give you folks. They had 1 year with no one and another at 136).
Creighton. they had already started to trend up before joining Big East. 198 in '09, 154 in '10, 125 in '11, 78 in '12.

You take 2010-12 which was 55.6 average team for Big East and compare to 2014-16 which was 54.4 average team. Pretty darn close...

Where I say is very positive is this year is 1st time really in the 9 years looking where it's very possible that the conference puts 2 back to back good years in the books. Last years 52.2 was 3rd best in the 8 years- behind only 2011 and 2014.

And I would also argue that the transfer market is where the Big East has really improved.

[Xudash]

my point is that recruiting hasn't really taken much of an uptick with the new conference. Go look at the 2011 and 2012 classes. They were excellent. 2012 had 13 4 and 5 star guys. 5 top 30 schools. 11 had 7 top 50 schools.

And my point is that a lot of what is left in the top 100 is in the top 50 and that's not normally where the Big East makes a lot of push. That's just the reality of things.

Lets see if the Big East can keep 6 teams in the top 50. Got 7 in the top 50 right now- but Providence, Seton Hall, and even St John's need to get more players to remain in the top 50.

Stever being Stever. Classic. Warns us all that, "just wait recruiting is going to fall off big time in this new conference." Then when it doesn't claims victory and states that "it might be similar to how it was before, no better." Yet he fails to recognize that programs like Creighton, Seton Hall, Butler and X, are now recruiting at a significantly higher level than before.

Your statement above that recruiting now is the same as Big East 2011-2012 is as much an admission of being wrong than anything you can write. Keep on moving that agenda forward.

#NationalF'ingChamps

Exactly.

Chris Mack is gaining interest from and in some cases securing commitments from kids that Xavier would never have had a shot at were it still in the A10.

Otherwise, the name WABISSA BEED is just strong. I hope Butler lands him.

[stever20]

my point is that recruiting hasn't really taken much of an uptick with the new conference. Go look at the 2011 and 2012 classes. They were excellent. 2012 had 13 4 and 5 star guys. 5 top 30 schools. 11 had 7 top 50 schools.

And my point is that a lot of what is left in the top 100 is in the top 50 and that's not normally where the Big East makes a lot of push. That's just the reality of things.

Lets see if the Big East can keep 6 teams in the top 50. Got 7 in the top 50 right now- but Providence, Seton Hall, and even St John's need to get more players to remain in the top 50.

Stever being Stever. Classic. Warns us all that, "just wait recruiting is going to fall off big time in this new conference." Then when it doesn't claims victory and states that "it might be similar to how it was before, no better." Yet he fails to recognize that programs like Creighton, Seton Hall, Butler and X, are now recruiting at a significantly higher level than before.

Your statement above that recruiting now is the same as Big East 2011-2012 is as much an admission of being wrong than anything you can write. Keep on moving that agenda forward.

#NationalF'ingChamps

Exactly.

Chris Mack is gaining interest from and in some cases securing commitments from kids that Xavier would never have had a shot at were it still in the A10.

Otherwise, the name WABISSA BEED is just strong. I hope Butler lands him.

Xavier in the 2010-12 seasons had recruiting classes ranked 19,21,26. Since joining the Big East had classes ranked 61,17,110,28. Xavier was recruiting pretty darn well before.

[Xudash]

Stever being Stever. Classic. Warns us all that, "just wait recruiting is going to fall off big time in this new conference." Then when it doesn't claims victory and states that "it might be similar to how it was before, no better." Yet he fails to recognize that programs like Creighton, Seton Hall, Butler and X, are now recruiting at a significantly higher level than before.

Your statement above that recruiting now is the same as Big East 2011-2012 is as much an admission of being wrong than anything you can write. Keep on moving that agenda forward.

#NationalF'ingChamps

Exactly.

Chris Mack is gaining interest from and in some cases securing commitments from kids that Xavier would never have had a shot at were it still in the A10.

Otherwise, the name WABISSA BEED is just strong. I hope Butler lands him.

Stever: Xavier in the 2010-12 seasons had recruiting classes ranked 19,21,26. Since joining the Big East had classes ranked 61,17,110,28. Xavier was recruiting pretty darn well before.

Stever, this is precisely the kind of response that causes you to electronically soil yourself.

The thread is about recruiting classes.

You put all your weight on recruiting class rankings.

I made a very specific point about the caliber of player Xavier is now going after and, in certain cases, garnering commitments from to the program. To this point, and as a very specific and irrefutable point, it is a stated fact that Trevon Bluiett would never have become a Musketeer had Xavier still been in the A10 and not a member of the Big East. We would have had no shot at him.

And to my overall point, Chris Mack is attracting attention and in some cases strong interest from 5-Star recruits now. This is a NEW NORM for Xavier: landing 4's consistently and now competing for 5's from time to time. Those 2010-12 class rankings do not and cannot ACCOUNT for the talent level Xavier is attracting now.

You want to go with recruiting class rankings? Okay (2016 = 13th): http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/college/xavier/xaviersports/2015/11/17/xavier-basketball-inks-two-four-star-recruits/75927772/. 13 beats 19, 21 and 26.

[hortle]

stever, you have the temerity to tell creighton fans that our recruiting was "trending up" in the years immediately preceding the move to the big east? please. the only players on the roster who were seriously on high major programs' radars were echenique and grant gibbs, and kind of Ethan Wragge. the first two were transfers from bigger programs. Our starting 2 guard for 3 years (manigat) had offers from canisius and cleveland state. IZ got few offers, maybe one from another power conference. doug was offered by UCF, UNI, and creighton. until 2013, our team was littered top to bottom with no name players in the eyes of recruitment services. the move to the big east set us on a completely altered trajectory in terms of recruiting. There is no way to argue otherwise... Go ahead and look back at the roster in 11-12. I would bet money most of those players had either 2 stars or a NR ranking.

[stever20]

stever, you have the temerity to tell creighton fans that our recruiting was "trending up" in the years immediately preceding the move to the big east? please. the only players on the roster who were seriously on high major programs' radars were echenique and grant gibbs, and kind of Ethan Wragge. the first two were transfers from bigger programs. Our starting 2 guard for 3 years (manigat) had offers from canisius and cleveland state. IZ got few offers, maybe one from another power conference. doug was offered by UCF, UNI, and creighton. until 2013, our team was littered top to bottom with no name players in the eyes of recruitment services. the move to the big east set us on a completely altered trajectory in terms of recruiting. There is no way to argue otherwise... Go ahead and look back at the roster in 11-12. I would bet money most of those players had either 2 stars or a NR ranking.

The thing is go look at your last 2 sentences.

here's the class ratings for Creighton for the last 8 years...
2009 198
2010 154
2011 125
2012 78
2013 162
2014 54
2015 65
2016 84

what you are saying is totally supported by the numbers. 2009 class was 198 and 2010 class was 154. To go from 198 to 154 to 125 to 78 is trending up.

[stever20]

You want to go with recruiting class rankings? Okay (2016 = 13th): http://www.cincinnati.com/story/sports/college/xavier/xaviersports/2015/11/17/xavier-basketball-inks-two-four-star-recruits/75927772/. 13 beats 19, 21 and 26.

The recruiting race doesn't end on November 17. It ends pretty much now when all the kids are signed. Xavier's class for 2016 wrapped up at #29.

2012 Xavier got 2 4 stars by the composite.
2011 Xavier got 3 4 stars by the composite.
2010 Xavier got 3 4 stars by the composite.

so 8 4 star recruits in 3 years...

2013 1 4 star
2014 4 4 stars
2015 0 4 stars
2016 2 4 stars

so 7 4 star recruits in 3 years...

Bluiett was #39 in 2014....
just looking in 2012 Xavier recruited Semaj Christon. He was #29 in 2012.
2011 Xavier got Dez Wells. He was #54 in 2011.

So how did they get Christon then? He was 10 spots higher than Bluiett was.

You undersell how well Xavier was recruiting in the A10. To have 3 classes in the top 26 in a row is pretty damn good.

[hortle]

stever, you have the temerity to tell creighton fans that our recruiting was "trending up" in the years immediately preceding the move to the big east? please. the only players on the roster who were seriously on high major programs' radars were echenique and grant gibbs, and kind of Ethan Wragge. the first two were transfers from bigger programs. Our starting 2 guard for 3 years (manigat) had offers from canisius and cleveland state. IZ got few offers, maybe one from another power conference. doug was offered by UCF, UNI, and creighton. until 2013, our team was littered top to bottom with no name players in the eyes of recruitment services. the move to the big east set us on a completely altered trajectory in terms of recruiting. There is no way to argue otherwise... Go ahead and look back at the roster in 11-12. I would bet money most of those players had either 2 stars or a NR ranking.

The thing is go look at your last 2 sentences.

here's the class ratings for Creighton for the last 8 years...
2009 198
2010 154
2011 125
2012 78
2013 162
2014 54
2015 65
2016 84

what you are saying is totally supported by the numbers. 2009 class was 198 and 2010 class was 154. To go from 198 to 154 to 125 to 78 is trending up.

So let me just delineate your thought process, so we can avoid confusion. You're essentially saying, "well, you started off really bad, then it became slightly better but still bad, then in your last year before the big east you guys had made it all the way up to mediocre classification. Therefore we can't be sure any positive changes in recruiting caliber correlating with the timeline of realignment isn't because your program was already on a huge (from really bad to kinda not horrible) upswing projection-wise".

Let me know if I missed anything.